Tech Questions/Advice
2500 Wear out at X-trannies [murx] (Sat May 16 23:42:03 1998)
   2501 Re: Wear out at X-trannies [jseabolt] (Sun May 17  4:37:05 1998)
   2502 Re: Wear out at X-trannies [James] (Sun May 17  6:02:33 1998)
   2517 Re: Wear out at X-trannies [lgabb] (Sun May 17 21:10:23 1998)
      2533 Re: Wear out at X-trannies [Dave] (Mon May 18 10:43:34 1998)
   2642 Tranny mods [jman] (Thu May 21 15:51:03 1998)
      2652 Re: Tranny mods [MikeHynes] (Thu May 21 18:46:41 1998)

Hello,

does anybody of you all know why the synchros and other stuff of 
the X trans wear out hat fast. I know at least it depends on how 
the owner shifts, but I would like to know if there are other 
reasons for this behaviour. May the high temperatures yield to 
further damage (This seems to be a common problem with 
mid-engined cars). Would it be possible to install an oil coller 
for the trannie ? (I know everyting is possible, it depends on 
time/money invested).

I am curious on what you think about it.

Matthias
Frankfurt Area / Federal Republic of Germany
http://www.igd.fhg.de/~stiller/htmlfiles/fiatlinks.html

Matthias Stiller wrote:
: Hello,
: does anybody of you all know why the synchros and other stuff
of 
: the X trans wear out hat fast. I know at least it depends on
how 
: the owner shifts, but I would like to know if there are other 
: reasons for this behaviour. May the high temperatures yield to 
: further damage (This seems to be a common problem with 
: mid-engined cars). Would it be possible to install an oil
coller 
: for the trannie ? (I know everyting is possible, it depends on 
: time/money invested).
: I am curious on what you think about it.
: Matthias
: Frankfurt Area / Federal Republic of Germany
: http://www.igd.fhg.de/~stiller/htmlfiles/fiatlinks.html


I've owned several Fiats all with transmission problems so they
are not limited to X 1/9s. Seems like the engines are
bulletproof but the transmissions won't hold up.

 Another strange thing is everytime I have pulled a transmission
the clutch is always good so that's not good if a clutch will
outlast a transmission!

One thing that may have something to do with it is the fact that
Fiats (older ones anyway) require GL-1 gear oil. GL-5 is the
most common and Fiats are the only cars I know of that use GL-1
in the gearbox.

Most people don't know this since their owners manuals are
usually missing and since almost every car uses GL-5 they assume
FIATs do as well.

GL-1 is not hard to find and in fact is cheap compared to GL-5.
I can get a gallon of GL-1 from Napa autoparts for $4.00 where
as a quart of GL-5 costs maybe $1.85. But about the only place
you can find GL-1 is either from a tractor supply store or Napa
or a Fiat parts distributor.

I've heard that if you pause for about 1/2 second between gears,
the transmissions will go forever but it would take you twice as
long to get to 60 mph!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1980 Fiat 2000 Spider (injected)
1981 Fiat 2000 Spider (dual carbed) awaiting rebuilt tranny
1981 Fiat X 1/9 (injected)
1994 Jeep Wrangler (2.5 liter)

Homepage: http://pages.preferred.com/~jseabolt/

mailto:email user is jseabolt and domain is preferred.com

Matthias Stiller wrote:
: Hello,
: does anybody of you all know why the synchros and other stuff 
of 
: the X trans wear out hat fast. I know at least it depends on 
how 
: the owner shifts, but I would like to know if there are other 
: reasons for this behaviour. May the high temperatures yield to 
: further damage (This seems to be a common problem with 
: mid-engined cars). Would it be possible to install an oil 
coller 
: for the trannie ? (I know everyting is possible, it depends on 
: time/money invested).
: I am curious on what you think about it.
: Matthias
: Frankfurt Area / Federal Republic of Germany
: http://www.igd.fhg.de/~stiller/htmlfiles/fiatlinks.html

I must agree,Matthias, the transmissions on X1/9's leave a 
little to be desired particularly the weak synchromesh on third 
gear.

While oil type in an X1/9's gearbox is very important (no EP 
oils) I believe the basic problem stems from the fact these 
gearboxs commenced life in cars such as the 127 which used 
essentially the 850 motor and even the 1300 X1/9  in standard 
form is much more demanding. Added to this, is many of us who 
enjoy the X1/9 usually modify the motor adding considerable 
extra horses and forget about the transmission. We then go track 
racing and wonder why the gearbox complains.

Certainly use an appropriate oil( I use a non EP Agip 
Synthethic, but there are many other very good transmission 
oils), but the solution will either be an expensive modification 
or simply to learn effective double de-clutching. Using this 
method to change down gears will over come the problem of weak 
synchromesh.In any case it is arguably the only way to change 
down gears, particularly at speed.

Good luck and enjoy your X1/9 - a most undervalued true sports 
car!!

Reg Howard-Smith
Fiats - 600 Multipla, 600D Berlina, 850 Spider( PBS 8 port 
head), X1/9 (PBS Big Valve head), 128 3P
Lancias - Fulvia 1.3S, Beta HPE

Matthias Stiller wrote:
: Hello,
: does anybody of you all know why the synchros and other stuff
of the X trans wear out hat fast. 

I wore out the 2nd gear syncro on my new 72 850 Spider at about
10,000 miles. When I took it back to the dealer(Knoxville,Tn)
for warranty repair, the district rep happened to be there. When
I took him for a drive to show him how the gear would sometimes
grind, he said I was shifting too fast and was "abusing" the
transmission and refused to warrant the repair. No wonder Fiat
is no longer here! Louis   
Florence, Alabama
72 850 Spyder(original owner)
74 124 Spyder

Another problem with X1/9transmisiions, and perhaps the reason we 
drivers contribute to their demise, is the #$%@*&! clutch 
hydrallics. If there is one weak link in the car which I have 
experienced over the past 24 years, it is the master and slave 
cylinders giving out.  Of course, we find out that they have 
failed by grinding the gears, etc.

Dave
1974 X1/9-original owner

Anybody here ever modify their Fiat trannies, eg. lightening
gears?
	JMan

JMan 
PBS will modify them about as much as you want.  I doubt many 
folks have them modify the stock gearset because it's not suited 
to racing (ratios are too wide).  They will make you a "straight 
gear" box and they can even do it so that the gear ratios are 
adjustable.
Mike, Peoria, IL.
'87 X1/9 Sunday driver;'79 X1/9 SCCA ITC;'78 X1/9 SCCA ITD;'74 
X1/9 SCCA DSP,.

dauber